Orlando Magic Blog

Group Blog talking about the NBA 2009 Eastern Conference Champions. Due to the amazing success of the 2009 playoff run comments are now frequently deleted to kill offensive comments, incoherence, or asininity. Comments can no longer be anonymous and require either a Blogger or OpenID account.

Friday, December 07, 2007

Magic fall flat in second half in surprising loss to IND

The Magic (16-5, 5-3 home), in their first home game in almost two weeks, started out well enough, leading by 8 pts at halftime, and extending the lead to 73-58 in the third. However, the Magic collapsed after that and could not stop IND (10-10, 6-4 road), as the hot-shooting Pacers made 8 of 11 3 pt FGs in the second half and finished on a 57-36 run to stun the Magic 115-109.

Seven Pacers scored in double figures, led by Danny Granger with 27 pts (6 of 7 3 pt FGs). Jamaal Tinsley added 20 pts, 10 asts, and 7 rebs.

Six Magic players scored in double figures, led by DHoward with 30 pts (9 of 13 FGs), 15 rebs, 4 steals, but 6 TOs; RLewis 24 pts (5 of 11 3 pt FGs); KBogans 14 pts (4 of 11 FGs); JNelson 11 pts (5 of 9 FGs) 5 asts; HTurkoglu 11 pts (3 of 15 3 pt FGs); and MEvans off the bench with 11 pts (5 of 7 FGs).

The statistical breakdown:

FGs... IND 39 of 86 (45.3%) ORL 35 of 81 (43.2%) IND 89 ORL 82
3 PT FGs... ORL 12 of 35 (34.3%) IND 11 of 20 (55%)
FTs... ORL 27 of 33 (81.8%) IND 26 of 33 (78.8%)
REBS... ORL 43 IND 43
AST/TO... IND 29/16 ORL 22/23
BENCH... IND 31 ORL 19

In the second half, the Magic shot just 13 of 39 FGs, including 5 of 18 3 pt FGs, while IND shot 21 of 43 FGs, including the 8 of 11 from 3 pt range. Magic were outscored 61-47 in the second half.

The Magic get the weekend off before their next game MON hosting ATL.


  • At 11:00 PM, Blogger Mike from Illinois said…

    The first home game after the long road trip did prove to be a "trap" game for the Magic after all. Coach Van Gundy has to be furious after the total second half meltdown by his club.

    Statistically, the Pacers pretty much dominated. They had a much better AST/TO ratio and shot the ball much more efficiently than the Magic. Even though the Magic made one more 3 pt FG than IND, the Pacers shot 15 fewer 3 pt attempts. 23 TOs by the Magic looks pretty ugly also.

    This was probably Turkoglu's worst game of the season... 3 of 15 FGs, including 1 of 7 3 pt FGs, and 6 TOs. He and Bogans combined to shoot just 7 of 26 FGs, and 4 of 17 3 pt FGs. I kind of wonder why the Magic didn't try to drive the ball more or get the ball in to Dwight more with their outside shots not falling.

    Howard and Lewis were the only starters to have decent games, with Evans doing well off the bench, and Arroyo dishing the ball well off the bench with 6 asts in just 17 mins.

    Wonder why Dooling didn't play? He's been really valuable off the bench, and I'm sure SVG would have used him if he was available.

    Even though the Pacers have some pretty good players, this was the Magic's worst loss of the season, especially considering the 15 pt 3rd qtr lead the Magic had and suddenly losing control. Coach Van Gundy will conduct a hard practice or two this weekend, that's for sure.

  • At 4:55 AM, Blogger OVERWADED said…

    This one was a hard loss for me to swallow.

    But it's not like we haven't seen the Magic play like this before. The difference tonight was, we went cold at the wrong time. The Pacers stepped up and made plays, and for one of the first times all season, we didn't meet the challenge.

    Another thing worth mentioning is the break the team just had. Not only was this the first game back from a long road trip, but they came back home and had 3 days off which has been rare for this team. While I understand rest can be valuable, the timing was bad. Sometimes a break isn’t a good thing for a team that is playing well.

    Hopefully the Magic will take this loss personal, bounce back, and let out their frustration against the Hawks Monday night.

  • At 9:36 AM, Blogger Big Figure said…

    SVG was very candid after the game and questioned his own coaching/substitutions on the night. That was the first game i would say that i've seen the magic play this year that i would totally blame the coach for the loss. Mike,keyon was healthy and ready to go but didnt play. WHY??????? How and the world can any coach justify not playing your best bench player???????? I'm 100% tired of watching carlos come off the bench and basically give us nothing but assists,THATS NOT ENOUGH!!!!!!! Keyon played lights out as the back-up point guard,the same night carlos gets back in the line-up we lose,hmmmmmm!!!!! Jameer struggled and hedo struggled and on the west coast trip it was keyon who time and time again came of the bench and gave us energy defensively and attacked the basket in transition dunking on everybody,the fact that he didnt play last night is a huge coaching blunder! On the west coast trip the three players that played well together off the bench were keyon,JJ and mo evans at the 1,2 and 3 spots. Carlos coming back means that line-up wont be used as much which is bad for our bench production (i fearded carlos would mess things up),we were matching our opponents bench production after the cook evans trade,but last night with carlos at the helm of our second unit we get outscored!!!!!! SVG admitted that the line-up he had on the floor to the end the third was horrible and didnt benefit the players (even though the teams defense wasnt great either,SVG took alot of the blame un like you-know-who)well it was a carlos lead unit that got totally outscored and put the pacers in position to play a close game when the starters had given us a 15 point lead. Im not saying that i dont like carlos the person,but carlos the basketball player is keeping other good players from playing their natural positions,and our best line-ups from playing together,as long as carlos is the back-up point guard im not gonna be happy with SVG in that regard.

  • At 9:48 AM, Blogger Big Figure said…

    With all the rambling my basic point might have gotten lost,which is the fact that the magic werent the same team against the pacers that went 4-1 on the road trip. The team that went 4-1 on the road trip had a defensive presence backing up jameer (keyon),and it was clear we needed that lift at the front of our defense. Last night we were an average team at best that was super soft and un-athletic defensively at the front of our defense,and the sign that this is really an issue is when the pacers made their comeback,with the second unit on the floor lead by arroyo. Dribble penetration became so easy with his lack of foot-speed,and when his jumper isnt going he's useless because he really struggle's getting to the basket or free-throw line. Keyon does all those things at a much higher level,defensive foot-speed good,ability to get to the basket good,how can SVG continue to play carlos before keyon? And keyon getting minutes at the two and JJ not playing wont make me happy either!!!!!!!!! I want the team with a keyon lead second unit!!!!!!!

  • At 5:19 PM, Blogger OVERWADED said…

    BIG, I understand what you're saying, and it makes sense.

    Here are my thoughts:

    Keyon struggles to get other players involved. In the 2 games he played PG, he posted an assist/turnover ratio of 7/3. Not bad, but not great either... But what he can do is defend, and use his quickness to get a few easy baskets. And that showed up in his point production (14, 10).

    Arroyo is on the court for one big reason, he knows how to dish the ball. In the last 4 games Arroyo has played, he hasn't gotten into double figures in scoring once, but the most shots he's attempted in any of those games was 5. Where he makes his mark, and what he's out there to do is pass the ball. In those same 4 games, he posted an assist to turnover ratio of 31/4. That's pretty damn good...

    Before Arroyo left in the middle of the road trip, he was the point guard closing out the games in the 4th quarter, not Nelson.

    Still, you make a valid point. Dooling was more than solid against the Lakers and Warriors. How that earned him a DNP-CP last night is BEYOND ME! He would have been a great answer for Tinsley.

    For that matter, he would have been more productive than Redick last night.

    It was a mistake by Van Gundy not playing Dooling at all, but at least he realized it.

    At the same time, Arroyo has been giving us some solid play as our back up point guard. But that shouldn't mean Dooling doesn't even get to break a sweat.

  • At 6:59 PM, Blogger Mike from Illinois said…

    Both you guys make good points. I tend to side a little more with OVERWADED in regard to Arroyo. Big Figure, I think you were a little too hard on Arroyo. What you said about his foot speed on defense is true, but it's not like Arroyo hasn't been contributing. Like OVERWADED pointed out, Arroyo's AST/TO ratio off ther bench has been fantastic, and did help lead to a win on one of the recent west coast games.

    Both you guys are right regarding Dooling. He needs to get in the game at some point if he is healthy and available. It was an obvious mistake by our coach. It is nice to see SVG take accountability for his mistakes, unlike Brian Hill who would always cluelessly say "I don't have any answers."

    Sooner or later, the Magic are going to have to trade one of the guards (Dooling, Arroyo, Evans or Redick) to get a more consistent bench rotation. I think it'll either be Arroyo or Redick that eventually gets traded, but who knows? Time will tell. Hopefully things will work themselves out.

  • At 11:56 AM, Blogger Big Figure said…

    Intro,i understand the flip side. Carlos is a good floor leader as well as passer,but i've been watching carlos (as we all have)for a couple of years now up close and personal and my opinion isnt going to change. Mike,i dont feel like im being hard on him or harsh,i feel like im being honest. The bottom line is this,assist to turn-over ratio/total assists is the only reason carlos is on the floor and thats all he really offers because leadership cant be calculated,and add on top of that the fact that his leadership didnt come into play against the pacers SECOND UNIT it wasnt even the starters!. Whether or not keyon has a great AST/TO ration or not doesnt really matter when he's on the court at the back-up point position because his on-the-ball defensive pressure keeps teams from being able to run their offensive sets effectively which is way more important than carlos getting 6 or 7 assists slowing us down running sets,defense create's scoring opportunity's and keeps your opponents shooting percentage down,with carlos on the floor our defensive integrity become's horrible at the most important spot on the floor "THE FRONT OF YOUR DEFENSE",plus with carlos in the game even though he's a good passer we run alot more sets which slows us down as a team. Listen i like carlos the person,but i was watching carlos before he even got to detroit and i always thought the same thing about him,his defensive footspeed is so bad that he really doesnt help you because he can make a great pass at one end and then on the other end try and play defense with his hands which create's fouls or easy lanes to the basket which again hurts your defensive integrity. Against average or bad teams sure carlos looks great (only as a passer,which for me isnt enough),but guys we have to start thinking bigger than that now,how will he perform against very good opposing playoff point guards? Any intelligent basketball mind would probably say not good,there's a reason he's been a back-up his whole career,there's a reason championship quality teams have let him go. Basically the question you have to ask yourself is,Who offers more? Easily keyon for me! Here's a quote from SVG i didnt like reading,"Van Gundy said he did not play Dooling, 6 feet 3, because the Pacers could play bigger men at his position". So this basically means that SVG really see's keyon as a back-up two-guard and emergency back-up point guard,so there's gonna be times that keyon wont match-up and probably wont play. HORRIBLE!!!! Keyon would play for me every night as my back-up point guard and situational two-guard.

  • At 11:57 AM, Blogger Big Figure said…

    To me its easy,if anyone has to go it should be carlos!

  • At 9:46 PM, Blogger Mike from Illinois said…

    Big Figure, you state your case well. Coach Van Gundy realized he messed up with his questionable substitutions against the Pacers that helped the Pacers overcome the 15 pt Magic lead. I would much rather point the finger at SVG for the rotation that he used rather than point the finger at Arroyo for this loss. Arroyo needs to be surrounded by the right players to make up for his defensive deficiencies in those situations. If Dooling would have been on the floor at all, it's doubtful that the Pacers could have come back to win.

    Hopefully, we see more of Dooling against the Hawks; I still hope SVG can continue to spot J.J. Redick minutes also. I know it's tough to get Redick playing time with the rotation the way it is, but we're going to have to live with it for the time being. We're 16-5, so I won't complain too much.

  • At 2:02 PM, Blogger Big Figure said…

    Me too to be honest,carlos didnt put himself in the game.


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